What’s “easier”, XC or Endurance?

The Kalmyk said:
Yes!

I mean isn’t science about searching for the truth? I don’t think you can measure to 100 in science- call me out scientist if I’m wrong.

Is the power source of each bike 100% identical? Without a margin of error?
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I'm open to discussion on it and love hearing both sides. My thought is that the ability to stay in an optimal cadence is going to allow you to ride faster with more power for longer.

Standing and mashing a big gear up a climb puts more fatigue on your whole body. That is why your HR goes through the roof when you stand and crush a gear. With gears, you are able to sit and maintain a cadence that will keep your heart rate down and climb at the same rate.
When you go downhill on a singlespeed, you can spin at 110-125rpm, but at some point, you are unable to put power down. Even on flat stretches of road, you can do 20mph on a singlespeed for sure. With gears, you can do the same speed with less effort.

My thought; if you do a climb, with gears, at 300w for 20 minutes at a basic cadence of say 90-95rpm, versus the guy on a singlespeed that just climbed out the saddle for that same 20 minutes, likely with more power because of his harder gear and at something stupid like 50-60rpm, who is going to reach the top of climb with fresher legs? Who is going to be able to repeat that effort again?


Arguments that XYZ won a race on a singlespeed versus geared riders are not proving anything
 
Mountain Bike Mike said:
287 north of i80... we’d drag knees on the back roads then jump on to 287 and open shit up and hit another exit and hit more twisties, rinse repeat
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Regardless, gearing is just math for top end.

Riding isn't just math.
 
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Pearl said:
I'm open to discussion on it and love hearing both sides. My thought is that the ability to stay in an optimal cadence is going to allow you to ride faster with more power for longer.

Standing and mashing a big gear up a climb puts more fatigue on your whole body. That is why your HR goes through the roof when you stand and crush a gear. With gears, you are able to sit and maintain a cadence that will keep your heart rate down and climb at the same rate.
When you go downhill on a singlespeed, you can spin at 110-125rpm, but at some point, you are unable to put power down. Even on flat stretches of road, you can do 20mph on a singlespeed for sure. With gears, you can do the same speed with less effort.

My thought; if you do a climb, with gears, at 300w for 20 minutes at a basic cadence of say 90-95rpm, versus the guy on a singlespeed that just climbed out the saddle for that same 20 minutes, likely with more power because of his harder gear and at something stupid like 50-60rpm, who is going to reach the top of climb with fresher legs? Who is going to be able to repeat that effort again?


Arguments that XYZ won a race on a singlespeed versus geared riders are not proving anything
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If I choose to believe you then back and forth ceases. That’s more or less what I’m hinting at?.

We should be arguing, if we travel in a circle will we ever reach the end?
 
Pearl said:
DT Would not like that


Well since you cant change gears, you cant optimally be in the right gear to maintain that cadence.

That's like saying my favorite color is chicken.
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Pearl said:
I'm open to discussion on it and love hearing both sides. My thought is that the ability to stay in an optimal cadence is going to allow you to ride faster with more power for longer.

Standing and mashing a big gear up a climb puts more fatigue on your whole body. That is why your HR goes through the roof when you stand and crush a gear. With gears, you are able to sit and maintain a cadence that will keep your heart rate down and climb at the same rate.
When you go downhill on a singlespeed, you can spin at 110-125rpm, but at some point, you are unable to put power down. Even on flat stretches of road, you can do 20mph on a singlespeed for sure. With gears, you can do the same speed with less effort.

My thought; if you do a climb, with gears, at 300w for 20 minutes at a basic cadence of say 90-95rpm, versus the guy on a singlespeed that just climbed out the saddle for that same 20 minutes, likely with more power because of his harder gear and at something stupid like 50-60rpm, who is going to reach the top of climb with fresher legs? Who is going to be able to repeat that effort again?


Arguments that XYZ won a race on a singlespeed versus geared riders are not proving anything
Click to expand...
But typically a higher cadence with same power output raises hr.
 
Pearl said:
I'm open to discussion on it and love hearing both sides. My thought is that the ability to stay in an optimal cadence is going to allow you to ride faster with more power for longer.

Standing and mashing a big gear up a climb puts more fatigue on your whole body. That is why your HR goes through the roof when you stand and crush a gear. With gears, you are able to sit and maintain a cadence that will keep your heart rate down and climb at the same rate.
When you go downhill on a singlespeed, you can spin at 110-125rpm, but at some point, you are unable to put power down. Even on flat stretches of road, you can do 20mph on a singlespeed for sure. With gears, you can do the same speed with less effort.

My thought; if you do a climb, with gears, at 300w for 20 minutes at a basic cadence of say 90-95rpm, versus the guy on a singlespeed that just climbed out the saddle for that same 20 minutes, likely with more power because of his harder gear and at something stupid like 50-60rpm, who is going to reach the top of climb with fresher legs? Who is going to be able to repeat that effort again?


Arguments that XYZ won a race on a singlespeed versus geared riders are not proving anything
Click to expand...
This is skewed unless you are elite level.
 
Mountain Bike Mike said:
287 north of i80... we’d drag knees on the back roads then jump on to 287 and open shit up and hit another exit and hit more twisties, rinse repeat
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ah, that was you! i lived in boonton on one of the streets that dead ended into 287 (no sound wall there) 😀

it was great before they finished the link to the thruway. Many an argument were settled between vreeland ave, and montville!
 
Mountain Bike Mike said:
L

Kinda applies here as well... I could show you videos and have people cosign the story but you still believe what you want..

I’ll go back to minding my own business now...

See yall in a couple months and I tune in again.
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wait - you need to reride those gravel segments on the mtb, and report back.
that is the controlled experiment part.

Dave Taylor said:
But typically a higher cadence with same power output raises hr.
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300w@60 is different than 300w@90rpm

there may be some confusion on what a watt is measuring -
a watt is not a unit of force.
it is force X intensity. consider the cadence is the intensity,
so to create 300W @60 will require more force. If you apply the same force at the difference cadence, the wattage would change.
Watts are also an instantaneous measure, not one over time (the one over time is energy)

go sim it on the kickr with the app. it'll fatigue muscles which are harder to recover, at the low cadence, vs the high cadence
which stresses the aerobic system, which is quickly recovered.

so while the two scenarios measure the same energy used, they tax different systems to get there.
 
Patrick said:
wait - you need to reride those gravel segments on the mtb, and report back.
that is the controlled experiment part.



300w@60 is different than 300w@90rpm

there may be some confusion on what a watt is measuring -
a watt is not a unit of force.
it is force X intensity. consider the cadence is the intensity,
so to create 300W @60 will require more force. If you apply the same force at the difference cadence, the wattage would change.
Watts are also an instantaneous measure, not one over time (the one over time is energy)

go sim it on the kickr with the app. it'll fatigue muscles which are harder to recover, at the low cadence, vs the high cadence
which stresses the aerobic system, which is quickly recovered.

so while the two scenarios measure the same energy used, they tax different systems to get there.
Click to expand...
Where is @terrabike01 when u need him? He’s gonna prove an mtb is faster than his road bike for hillier than though next year.
 
Singlespeed rigid - 32:17 Was super fast at H2H Mayhem race in all the singletrack until the fireroads where I spun out and the mudbogs where I stalled down to like 30rpm



I know for a fact that I’d be faster on my anthem around that course because It would be very comparable in all the singletrack and would be faster on the fireroads and mudbogs because I could shift.

On the fireroads, I could accelerate to a smaller cog and stay within my optimal cadence. I could maintain speed through the mud by shifting to an easier gear and spinning.
 
Mountain Bike Mike said:
Singlespeed rigid - 32:17 Was super fast at H2H Mayhem race in all the singletrack until the fireroads where I spun out and the mudbogs where I stalled down to like 30rpm



I know for a fact that I’d be faster on my anthem around that course because It would be very comparable in all the singletrack and would be faster on the fireroads and mudbogs because I could shift.

On the fireroads, I could accelerate to a smaller cog and stay within my optimal cadence. I could maintain speed through the mud by shifting to an easier gear and spinning.
Click to expand...
34/16 there bra
 
Mountain Bike Mike said:
Singlespeed rigid - 32:17 Was super fast at H2H Mayhem race in all the singletrack until the fireroads where I spun out and the mudbogs where I stalled down to like 30rpm



I know for a fact that I’d be faster on my anthem around that course because It would be very comparable in all the singletrack and would be faster on the fireroads and mudbogs because I could shift.

On the fireroads, I could accelerate to a smaller cog and stay within my optimal cadence. I could maintain speed through the mud by shifting to an easier gear and spinning.
Click to expand...
source.gif
 
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