The Kalmyk
Well-Known Member
How can this guy sleep at night. Freakin sick in the mind and ego! Make a separate category… he isnt a woman.
Last edited:
BWR womens winner is a guy…What a bunch of horse isshh
- Thread starter The Kalmyk
- Start date
- Status
I'm sure this will be another rousing discussion.
The Kalmyk
Well-Known Member
We should start with taking a deep dive into Paige Onweller’s training plan and everything behind it like the sacrifices, time management, etc…
He straight up stole five grand from her.
Starting the conversation off with calling her a guy several times starting this thread is just on brand. For the record, Paige sounds more level headed and less upset than you.
rick81721
Lothar
He's a biological male. Fact. I really don't understand why real women allow this nonsense to continue.
Last edited:
The Kalmyk
Well-Known Member
You havent even heard me say anything,lol!! And he is a guy.
That PR manager knows how to set her up. Deep down, she’s raging.
rick81721
Lothar
I think I figured out a way to profit from this lunacy. I have 50 Troy ounces of copper pennies but they identify as 99.9% gold so you have to buy them from me for $100,000.
johnbryanpeters
Well-Known Member
Winner.
To be fair, while her presentation is good, she isn't saying she is agreeing with the rules. Lets be real, BWR is small potatoes, let's wait to see how this plays out at a premier woman's event like the MTB world cup or the woman's world tour, etc.
I'm sure it will all go perfectly fine.
No, but there's a pretty wide chasm between "underneath all helmets is a face and a person who deserves respect, dignity, and a safe space to ride bikes" coming from the only person who actually has any reason to be aggrieved and:
I feel like disagreeing with the current UCI rules is one thing, but suggesting that someone is "sick in the mind and ego" for competing in a class in a bicycle race that they're eligible for is another. As is continuing to refer to her as a "guy". Cool, by all means have your position about pronouns, but is it that hard to respect people enough to refer to them the way that they want? Continuing to do this in spite of a person's wishes doesn't make you some heroic truth teller, it just makes you a jerk.
-There's two other people financially affected as each class got paid out for the top 3. Which is also kind of crazy with it being so large the payout is only top 3? Also for the professionals that are in let's say the top 10, results do matter with sponsors etc.
-I fully agree that the start of this thread is distasteful. I'm 100% against this woman from winning in the female class as the entire purpose of the class is to give a class to the women who have a biological difference from the men. There's no reason to be distasteful about it and as any serious subject should be discussed in a serious manner. Be a dick about your tire insert choice, but this is not the subject for that behavior. The Kalmyk isn't changing any opinions coming out of the gate like that.
-If women who finish below this person disagree with it, Paige has set a good example of how to properly put out the message. I'm sure there's a huge amount of riders that disagree but are silent as they don't want a backlash.
-I do wonder about the thoughts of the winner. While they may feel they are a woman, do they feel that they won by 5 minutes because of the hard work they put in, or because they were born a male? There's a distinct advantage that no twisting of facts can be denied at this point.
-I like cycling to be all inclusive and would love if there's a spot for everyone. But I don't think MtF transitioned people in the female class is it.
-If the winner signed up like many of the people doing this is as a fun/challenging ride and finished mid-pack I doubt most people would care.
If BWR had eBike classes this year but someone took at the rules and realized the regular class didn't actually exclude eBikes, brought one and then won by 5 minutes and collected the 10k prize? Sure it's allowed by the rules but it's still not right and the rules would be changed the following year.
Yeah, I guess that's mostly my point...arguing in good faith about the way that the rules are structured is totally fair, but attacking a specific person who is out there competing in a hard sport, putting in a ton of work, and achieving success in a race is just a shitty thing to do.
In terms of thoughts of the winner, this is prior to this specific event, but seems to offer a lot of insight:
www.cyclingnews.com
In terms of thoughts of the winner, this is prior to this specific event, but seems to offer a lot of insight:
'It is incredibly painful to be othered' - Austin Killips on division, debate and building dialogue
Speaking exclusively to Cyclingnews, Tour of the Gila winner Austin Killips discusses the impact of winning as a trans woman
www.cyclingnews.com
rick81721
Lothar
No it's just being factual to basic biology. If I identify as the King of Earth and demand that everyone bow in my presence and call me "your highness" should everyone respect my wishes?
Do you honestly believe that these are equivalent things? A person saying "Hey, I'd appreciate if you could call me she/her because I'm more comfortable with that" and "I am the King of Earth, bow down before me"? I just don't understand why it's such a huge problem to be respectful of a person's wishes.
World Athletics has taken the stand that any athlete who transitioned after puberty shall be excluded from competing in women's events.
Think track & field, but it has wider implications obviously.
The USATF & NCAA are currently using testosterone testing - which was already in-place.
This has some issues - but is a step towards a fair field.
Under what rules was this race run? A: UCI
UCI "allows" athletes to use their gender identity, given a 24 month test cycle of suppressed testosterone levels.
Now the weird thing is they changed the rule last year to reduce the level, and extend the time.
This is below the allowed level for birth gender females.
I suspect they will follow WA at some point.
--
on the accusation that CIS people will claim they are trans to win a race - probably not.
ya kinda get the lance armstrong treatment when someone figures it out.
Think track & field, but it has wider implications obviously.
The USATF & NCAA are currently using testosterone testing - which was already in-place.
This has some issues - but is a step towards a fair field.
Under what rules was this race run? A: UCI
UCI "allows" athletes to use their gender identity, given a 24 month test cycle of suppressed testosterone levels.
Now the weird thing is they changed the rule last year to reduce the level, and extend the time.
This is below the allowed level for birth gender females.
I suspect they will follow WA at some point.
--
on the accusation that CIS people will claim they are trans to win a race - probably not.
ya kinda get the lance armstrong treatment when someone figures it out.
this is wrong - the junk between your legs doesn't reflect your hormonal/emotional composition.
do a little reading on ambiguous genitalia. if it were so AorB, it wouldn't happen. And this is just the physical manifestation.
So many more things going on inside.
rick81721
Lothar
Yes it is exactly the same thing. We are in a world of hurt if people actually get offended by 3rd person pronouns. Oh my God, someone I don't know and will never know referred to me as "him" on some obscure website. The horror!
rick81721
Lothar
Science is not "wrong". Good lord. Ambiguous genitalia/genetic aberrations are rare and not the reason for most transitions.
- Status