Frozen water main - suggestions?

fidodie said:
100' of 1" PB, couple of fittings and a ditch witch, 100' trace wire, blue warning tape.
Rotary hammer, couple of pipe wrenches, torch, mortar mix
case of beer, 4 pizzas, videographer (going live)
ambulance, lawyer
the big question is whether to follow the old line, which goes under walls, but has a predictable depth.
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Holy Sh*t this isn't a small thing. I'm torn about what to do. This morning I'd like to sleep a bit. And try to catch up on the work this thing has torpedoed. Can I give you a call?
 
seanrunnette said:
Don't have much of a choice. The one company that would have done this would have had the same results. No other plumbing or welding folks would touch it.
I married a NJ girl. They're tougher than most.
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Wow no pros would do this? Are you in north Dakota or new jersey? 😀
 
fidodie said:
bothered me all night that the clamps did not warm up, even a bit. I have no idea why the resistance would be so high. length of pipe?
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I'm risking total embarrassment here, but what if there was a PVC repair right in the middle of the run? I can't imagine that this was the very first time these pipes have frozen, considering their less than ideal depth. You'd never get conductivity with this scenario.
 
If you're going the replacement route I'd look into the replacement material a little further. Copper has its advantages (you need the flexible stuff). AFAIK PB has fallen out of favor due to longevity concerns. Make sure it's rated for potable water, whatever you use.
 
Dingo said:
I have a ditch witch if you have a trailer.
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4' arm?
I have a trailer.

The Squirrel said:
I'm risking total embarrassment here, but what if there was a PVC repair right in the middle of the run? I can't imagine that this was the very first time these pipes have frozen, considering their less than ideal depth. You'd never get conductivity with this scenario.
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when i connected the clamp, with the juice on, there was a healthy spark - equiv to hooking up car jumpers. not welding level, but convinced me there was a complete circuit. I'm thinking the run is long, and the cables are long - hence very high resistance. a reasonable test would be to hook up a run of pipe (min 15' per instructions) turn it on, and see if it gets hot (warm)
 
rlb said:
If you're going the replacement route I'd look into the replacement material a little further. Copper has its advantages (you need the flexible stuff). AFAIK PB has fallen out of favor due to longevity concerns. Make sure it's rated for potable water, whatever you use.
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ugh - really! pb is so simple to work with when it is below freezing. (make snapping sound)
how about pex? nice roll of 3/4"....

@ktmrider - what have you seen here?
 
fidodie said:
ugh - really! pb is so simple to work with when it is below freezing. (make snapping sound)
how about pex? nice roll of 3/4"....

@ktmrider - what have you seen here?
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I should clarify a little, 80's and 90's PB pipe has a bad history. Not sure if that's been remedied in newer formulations. I checked the code for approved materials and it's not in there (pdf page 18).
http://www.phccweb.org/content.cfm?ItemNumber=15155&RDtoken=33616&userID=50621

I do know that pretty much every local utility uses copper from the water main to the curb. They've been in the business a while...
 
fidodie said:
4' arm?
I have a trailer.



when i connected the clamp, with the juice on, there was a healthy spark - equiv to hooking up car jumpers. not welding level, but convinced me there was a complete circuit. I'm thinking the run is long, and the cables are long - hence very high resistance. a reasonable test would be to hook up a run of pipe (min 15' per instructions) turn it on, and see if it gets hot (warm)
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Pretty sure, this my landlords, I can get a pic if you want it's a large machine.
 
rlb said:
I should clarify a little, 80's and 90's PB pipe has a bad history. Not sure if that's been remedied in newer formulations. I checked the code for approved materials and it's not in there (pdf page 18).
http://www.phccweb.org/content.cfm?ItemNumber=15155&RDtoken=33616&userID=50621

I do know that pretty much every local utility uses copper from the water main to the curb. They've been in the business a while...
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interesting - i have pb from my well, and between buildings - great!
looks like there are pex options - i see flexible copper - wonder if it needs to be coated for underground use?

Bring in the family plumber! And upgrade the dinner selection to beef tenderloin!
 
I have 3/4 pex and crimp tools I can donate.
This is amazing. I did hope to wake up and find water flow. Sorry buddy.
If a ditch witch photo surfaces I'm coming over.
Glad Sean is keeping notes. This will be a fantastic podcast.
 
fidodie said:
ugh - really! pb is so simple to work with when it is below freezing. (make snapping sound)
how about pex? nice roll of 3/4"....

@ktmrider - what have you seen here?
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I would use insulated pex but I don't want this thread to end. Love how it started because he thought the cost was too much , equipment /insurance/ labor isn't cheap. I guess we all can't work for free
 
fidodie said:
interesting - i have pb from my well, and between buildings - great!
looks like there are pex options - i see flexible copper - wonder if it needs to be coated for underground use?
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Hmm...maybe I am wrong then? Or our terminology is getting crossed...

I don't think copper needs to be coated, but I think google would be a better resource than me.
 
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