Nassau Trails - partial closure

[GSTim]

We haven't been asked to write-up anything.
High Bridge and Clinton both embrace the cycling community, and are working to that end.

There is donated land with restrictions, the state as trustee, and two towns in the process.

I believe our best path is just to "support the process" and trust our advocates that granted the builders access to start this.

Consider this - say High Bridge wants to write the letter to change the restriction.
They have monthly meetings - and want to stay in-process - this isn't the I-95 collapse...
Clinton is involved, so can't go around them....

HB 1, agree to write letter
HB 2, review letter, recommend changes
HB 3, review letter, pass
HB 4, approve letter from last meeting, send to Clinton
Clinton 1: Read letter into agenda, prepare for next meeting
Clinton 2: Discuss response
Clinton 3: Review response, suggest changes
Clinton 4: Review changes, approve response
Clinton 5: approve letter to be sent
HB: Read response into agenda, discuss
HB: Recommend merging changes/suggestions
HB: Approve changes
Letter sent
DEP - Letter read into agenda, agree to review for next meeting
DEP - Discuss letter
DEP - Approve discussion, recommend response
DEP - Review Response, recommend changes
DEP - Approve changes
DEP - Approve sending letter
HB - read letter into agenda, and fast-track dissemination of decision (assuming positive)

Did i just create an 18 month timeline if everything goes as planned? Which it never does.

They are not going to call special meetings over this.
It is clear that MTB was excluded - so the process should show patience and that the community values the mtb presence,
which justifies the change from the 1990s/2000s restriction.

i'll check out the logs, i'm fairly sure they are not an approved barrier.
Someone may have thought they were going to stop people,
just like someone taking down the signs thought it would allow people.....

Sorry, not calling out you specifically. Just wanted to point out my opinion that the MTB community should not be responsible for restricting access (i.e. putting up signs) to trails that "we" helped build.

 

[Patrick]

Sorry, not calling out you specifically. Just wanted to point out my opinion that the MTB community should not be responsible for restricting access (i.e. putting up signs) to trails that "we" helped build.

HB DPW is working on proper signage.

 

[SAM]

Perhaps, to encourage an eventual positive ruling on re-opening the trails to MTB, people should not be riding the closed trails, removing signage, or disturbing them in any way. Demonstrating a responsible MTB community might help, as opposed to the opposite.

 

[rick81721]

Perhaps, to encourage an eventual positive ruling on re-opening the trails to MTB, people should not be riding the closed trails, removing signage, or disturbing them in any way. Demonstrating a responsible MTB community might help, as opposed to the opposite.

If there are no official signs there is no official "closing". How are the 99% of riders that never look at this board supposed to know what trails are "open", by osmosis?

 

[hls811]

If there are no official signs there is no official "closing". How are the 99% of riders that never look at this board supposed to know what trails are "open", by osmosis?

Exactly… I know about it from this site and it’s been posted on Facebook as well but the people I ride with who are fairly active online had no idea. Clear signs and blockages at the trails are the only way riders will know it’s closed but will still have no idea about the conversations going on.

 

[SAM]

If there are no official signs there is no official "closing". How are the 99% of riders that never look at this board supposed to know what trails are "open", by osmosis?

Not true, of course. Since when is ignorance an excuse? Information is available with 30 seconds research online. People should be aware of rules where they are riding and I believe most people are. Whether they follow them is a personal decision.

Didn't we just hear signs get removed? I wonder who is doing that? Anyway, it sounds like HB will be putting up proper signs soon. Hopefully, signs will not be vandalized or removed and riders will follow the rules. Situation needs some time to get worked out.

 

[Patrick]

I would like to point to some advice we received....

Nassau Trails - partial closure

Don't see anything on the High Bridge website

www.mtbnj.com

 

[rick81721]

Not true, of course. Since when is ignorance an excuse? Information is available with 30 seconds research online. People should be aware of rules where they are riding and I believe most people are. Whether they follow them is a personal decision.

Ignorance is not an excuse but failure to notify equals unenforceable. Since when is it a rider's responsibility to research what trails are open or not at a given park? That's ludicrous. There is one green sign in the parking lot that says "trails open". That's it.

 

[pkovo]

We haven't been asked to write-up anything.
High Bridge and Clinton both embrace the cycling community, and are working to that end.

There is donated land with restrictions, the state as trustee, and two towns in the process.

I believe our best path is just to "support the process" and trust our advocates that granted the builders access to start this.

Consider this - say High Bridge wants to write the letter to change the restriction.
They have monthly meetings - and want to stay in-process - this isn't the I-95 collapse...
Clinton is involved, so can't go around them....

HB 1, agree to write letter
HB 2, review letter, recommend changes
HB 3, review letter, pass
HB 4, approve letter from last meeting, send to Clinton
Clinton 1: Read letter into agenda, prepare for next meeting
Clinton 2: Discuss response
Clinton 3: Review response, suggest changes
Clinton 4: Review changes, approve response
Clinton 5: approve letter to be sent
HB: Read response into agenda, discuss
HB: Recommend merging changes/suggestions
HB: Approve changes
Letter sent
DEP - Letter read into agenda, agree to review for next meeting
DEP - Discuss letter
DEP - Approve discussion, recommend response
DEP - Review Response, recommend changes
DEP - Approve changes
DEP - Approve sending letter
HB - read letter into agenda, and fast-track dissemination of decision (assuming positive)

Did i just create an 18 month timeline if everything goes as planned? Which it never does.

They are not going to call special meetings over this.
It is clear that MTB was excluded - so the process should show patience and that the community values the mtb presence,
which justifies the change from the 1990s/2000s restriction.

i'll check out the logs, i'm fairly sure they are not an approved barrier.
Someone may have thought they were going to stop people,
just like someone taking down the signs thought it would allow people.....

@Pat, Is HB to your knowledge making an attempt to challenge or reverse the closure and this part of the deed? The above post outlines a potential plan of action, but listening to meetings and speaking with some in town, I am under the impression HB is NOT challenging this.

No doubt HB embraces the cycling community in general, the fact that the flow trails are actually back up and running after that tree debacle is a minor miracle, but again, seems like they are sitting this fight out to me.

Below link is to the 5/25 council meeting. Anyone interested can take a listen from around 1:33 on. Pablo (resident/cyclist) expresses his hopes in the public comments section that Mayor and council will fight the closure. The Mayor's response includes things such as:

"...There is really no fight here...", and "...At this point there's really nothing we can do..."

Of course there can always be more than meets the eye, but I didn't get any sense of "hope" from this.

HB 5-25 Council Meeting

 

[SAM]

I would like to point to some advice we received....

Nassau Trails - partial closure

Don't see anything on the High Bridge website

www.mtbnj.com

I'm all for "slow play this" but I'm not sure it will be wink, wink, ride, ride, nod, nod. Enforcement may start if HB puts the official trails closed signs up or if you come across a local hiker who complains to the town. Warnings and citations are just another personal risk, as long as riding closed trails does not lead to additional trail closures.

 

[Patrick]

@Pat, Is HB to your knowledge making an attempt to challenge or reverse the closure and this part of the deed? The above post outlines a potential plan of action, but listening to meetings and speaking with some in town, I am under the impression HB is NOT challenging this.

No doubt HB embraces the cycling community in general, the fact that the flow trails are actually back up and running after that tree debacle is a minor miracle, but again, seems like they are sitting this fight out to me.

Below link is to the 5/25 council meeting. Anyone interested can take a listen from around 1:33 on. Pablo (resident/cyclist) expresses his hopes in the public comments section that Mayor and council will fight the closure. The Mayor's response includes things such as:

"...There is really no fight here...", and "...At this point there's really nothing we can do..."

Of course there can always be more than meets the eye, but I didn't get any sense of "hope" from this.

HB 5-25 Council Meeting

There are people that are pro bike. I'm not sure what their plan is, but I know they want to reopen it. I'm just postulating that it is a minimum 18 month process.

I drove by today. The logs were moved off the trail. The trail open sign was moved across the street.

 

[stb222]

Perhaps, to encourage an eventual positive ruling on re-opening the trails to MTB, people should not be riding the closed trails, removing signage, or disturbing them in any way. Demonstrating a responsible MTB community might help, as opposed to the opposite.

My personal favorite is when there are multiple riders in a group and they all have a agreement to make the ride private and there is the one rider that didn't get the memo, posts and names the group of people.

 

[pkovo]

I noticed a new "trail closed to cyclists" sign in Nassau yesterday. It was in a spot that would allude to Springside being closed. Suspect (and hope) this is just a sign that was mis-placed.

If you enter the trails at the top pf the field and make a right, it was on that trail after passing the entrance to the sidewinder loop but before the Springside loop.

 

[Patrick]

I've requested that it be removed if not town approved, or relocated to the left turn into the restricted area which would be the proper spot

 

[pkovo]

I've requested that it be removed if not town approved, or relocated to the left turn into the restricted area which would be the proper spot

Thanks Pat!