Tariffs...what to make of them.

Dave Taylor said:
Right now the top ten wealthiest Americans are worth more than the lower 50%. That will change soon. They just approved Musk's $1T pay package.
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Meantime since Elon decided to get on stage with his chainsaw.... tesla's market share went from 80% of the US market down to 38%...they have laid off nearly 15,000 workers... And for this, the boss gets a one trillion dollar package.... America FUCK YA!
 
Dave Taylor said:
How are wages vs s&p? Ah, the black swan...
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Rhetorical bs
Wages have never matched the market.
Total disconnect

Wages vs cpi is the correct comparison.

Next level is the concept of disposable income and what we do with it , if we have it.

The rich get richer because the make more than they spend.

Amazingly, it is possible at average incomes. Diligence and time.
 
Dave Taylor said:
Right now the top ten wealthiest Americans are worth more than the lower 50%. That will change soon. They just approved Musk's $1T pay package.
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So what.
They employee thousands of people
Source from thousands of other companies
Create huge amounts of shareholder value

Figure out a way to ride the wave. There is no damage, except for the political power.
And believe it or not, all they want to do is have access those in power.

I had good advice from a business professor. You write a check to both parties, then meet the winner for coffee. Scale up as necessary
 
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Patrick said:
So what.
They employee thousands of people
Source from thousands of other companies
Create huge amounts of shareholder value

Figure out a way to ride the wave. There is no damage, except for the political power.
And believe it or not, all they want to do is have access those in power.

I had good advice from a business professor. You write a check to both parties, then meet the winner for coffee. Scale up as necessary
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Eh, except that Elon and Tesla has earned nearly 10 billion in regulatory credits....We the tax payers have a massive vested interest in the success and failure of Elon's companies...We backstop him and countless other too big to fail companies....Electric cars have only been able to get any traction with investments in infrastructure...incentives for manufactures....I can ride my bike over way more scary things when I have the entire US Govt. spotting me.
 
Dave Taylor said:
Right now the top ten wealthiest Americans are worth more than the lower 50%. That will change soon.
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you-sure-really.gif

I don't think you realize how little the lower 50% makes
 
UtahJoe said:
Eh, except that Elon and Tesla has earned nearly 10 billion in regulatory credits....We the tax payers have a massive vested interest in the success and failure of Elon's companies...We backstop him and countless other too big to fail companies....Electric cars have only been able to get any traction with investments in infrastructure...incentives for manufactures....I can ride my bike over way more scary things when I have the entire US Govt. spotting me.
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could be belching fog or we'd still be getting 9mpg and 180 hp from a 400ci v8 if it weren't for incentives and mandates.

sure - but isn't it good for everyone ?
all the pension plans (including gvt officials) tied up in these investments.
That is why AIG could not fail. or auto makers, etc.
These were cash flow issues for AIG. long term they could afford to pay back the float.
Same for Chrysler way back when.

Everyone should get a K-car.

We should get back to the drones sending video intelligence back to the iranian mothership off ft Monmouth.
 
UtahJoe said:
Eh, except that Elon and Tesla has earned nearly 10 billion in regulatory credits....We the tax payers have a massive vested interest in the success and failure of Elon's companies...We backstop him and countless other too big to fail companies....Electric cars have only been able to get any traction with investments in infrastructure...incentives for manufactures....I can ride my bike over way more scary things when I have the entire US Govt. spotting me.
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And he doesn't pay any taxes on his wealth.
 
stb222 said:
you-sure-really.gif

I don't think you realize how little the lower 50% makes
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we are using median here?
can we count the zeros?
---------------------------------------------------
The AI says.

the arithmetic mean of the wages below the median....

Based on the latest full-time median wage, your answer is an average somewhere between the 25th percentile and the 50th percentile.
  • Median Wage (50th percentile) for Full-Time Workers (Q2 2025): $62,192 per year.
  • The average for those earning less than this median would likely fall in the range of $35,000 to $45,000 annually, although a precise figure requires a specific calculation of the distribution's mean for the bottom half.
 
Robson said:
And he doesn't pay any taxes on his wealth.
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without being too much of an ass -
we don't pay taxes on wealth - we pay it on income.
he had a huge amount of income a few years back - paid like $10B in taxes on it.
now if he keeps his income to zero, and only has long term gains, he can avoid "big" tax - but probably pays 4%.
when he is granted stock, there is imputed income - that is when he pays.

on the flip side - I hear ya.
he isn't buying cars, insurance, food, clothes, travel, family stuff, it is all supplied by the company.
 
Patrick said:
without being too much of an ass -
we don't pay taxes on wealth - we pay it on income.
he had a huge amount of income a few years back - paid like $10B in taxes on it.
now if he keeps his income to zero, and only has long term gains, he can avoid "big" tax - but probably pays 4%.
when he is granted stock, there is imputed income - that is when he pays.

on the flip side - I hear ya.
he isn't buying cars, insurance, food, clothes, travel, family stuff, it is all supplied by the company.
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Yes, we don't pay taxes on wealth. And since they (Elon and the rest) have no income they don't pay any taxes or pay way less then us. There is something wrong with this. That is just my opinion.
 
Robson said:
Yes, we don't pay taxes on wealth. And since they (Elon and the rest) have no income they don't pay any taxes or pay way less then us. There is something wrong with this. That is just my opinion.
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While I agree, not sure how you promote capitalism and then try to punish those who succeed. Sure, billionaires should probably pay their fair share but where do you draw the line? Tax billionaires more and the guy with $999 million laughs his way to the bank. As stated above if only the income is taxed, and they have the professionals to make it disappear, do you just punish everyone who is rich? How much is rich?
 
Bike N Gear said:
Yet my CPA said I couldn’t/shouldn’t do that.
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if your job is to represent a company to shareholders, large corporate customers, lenders, etc, then your clothes are important.
When every second matters - that is when you get limos and private jets.

your CPA should have told you what you could do (ie SEP) and what expenses were reasonable.
mine didn't want me to lease a car - we logged miles/tolls
 
Patrick said:
if your job is to represent a company to shareholders, large corporate customers, lenders, etc, then your clothes are important.
When every second matters - that is when you get limos and private jets.

your CPA should have told you what you could do (ie SEP) and what expenses were reasonable.
mine didn't want me to lease a car - we logged miles/tolls
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Hope he got a good deduction for this:

Image 1.jpeg
 
Patrick said:
could be belching fog or we'd still be getting 9mpg and 180 hp from a 400ci v8 if it weren't for incentives and mandates.

sure - but isn't it good for everyone ?
all the pension plans (including gvt officials) tied up in these investments.
That is why AIG could not fail. or auto makers, etc.
These were cash flow issues for AIG. long term they could afford to pay back the float.
Same for Chrysler way back when.

Everyone should get a K-car.

We should get back to the drones sending video intelligence back to the iranian mothership off ft Monmouth.
Click to expand...
I do agree...the incentives are a good thing to help drive innovation...they are needed...but in the case of Elon...what has it actually done? It has created a self important oligarch...With all of the money he has made he bought himself a position in our government...He then used this position to further protect his billions in govt. contracts while canceling others....One person....benefitting from govt. incentives, loans, laws and contracts.....taking the profits from such things and then spending it to influence our policies....

ALL THE WHILE.....

Using his total control of tesla to ram thru the biggest automotive flop we have ever seen.....the cybertruck debacle didnt happen in a vacuum....The factory was built with loans and tax breaks....thousands of workers have been laid off....Point being...this is not "good for everyone"
 
Bike N Gear said:
While I agree, not sure how you promote capitalism and then try to punish those who succeed. Sure, billionaires should probably pay their fair share but where do you draw the line? Tax billionaires more and the guy with $999 million laughs his way to the bank. As stated above if only the income is taxed, and they have the professionals to make it disappear, do you just punish everyone who is rich? How much is rich?
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That is the question. This is good explanation how system works right now
 
Robson said:
That is the question. This is good explanation how system works right now
Click to expand...


Somewhere I mentioned the untaxed transfer of wealth with the reset of the basis is a problem.
Agree

If Zuck builds a business that is worth $100B - good for him.

If it weren't for Trump, someone like Elon doesn't take the stage. You see the Koch bros dancing?

If one person not paying taxes has built a company with 100,000 employees paying taxes......
 
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