mntal
Well-Known Member
can someone comment on this? this is great news and frankly, important. does he do the jungle?
Another Cyclist Murdered
- Thread starter xmonger
- Start date
Tim
aka sptimmy43
I'm glad this came up. We (and I truly mean we in the collective sense) get very entrenched in our camps. I think most of us overlap a lot more than we realize. I'm honestly glad this thread didn't get locked up. I mean, there were some "interesting" posts here and there but overall, it's been a good discussion, even if no one changes "sides." I am sure a few people thought about things from a different point of view, if even just for a minute, and that's a good thing. These are the types of open and productive discussions that have been lost in recent years.
Johnny Utah
Well-Known Member
sundaydoug
Well-Known Member
Yup, he lives in West Milford, I think somewhere in the Pinecliff Lake area. But when I saw him he unfortunately was driving a green Range Rover, not an orange '69 Charger.
Fire Lord Jim
Well-Known Member
I agree that many things are deadly. But few can be easily carried on a bicycle, which is how this thread started.
The jersey pocket sags a bit. That's because it holds...
The SIG 938 is a 9mm. It would work fine for concealed carry on a ride.
The SIG 938 is a 9mm. It would work fine for concealed carry on a ride.
Ian F
Well-Known Member
My understanding is that he often does stage work in NYC, so living in NNJ wouldn't be surprising.
Fun fact: neither of the Duke Boys is from the South: Wopat - Lodi, WI. Schneider - Mt Kisko, NY. Schneider does live in the South, is far more vocal on various issues on his YouTube channel and I believe does have at least one General Lee replica in his fleet. He has sold one or two of them over the years (IIRC) for charity.
These types of discussions about guns are always interesting to me, as someone who pretty much solidly in the middle of the debate. I believe more regulation is needed, but the types of guns or magazines being restricted is at this point a lost cause.
rick81721
Lothar
Yep agreed. No issue with more gun control laws here.
Mtbdog
Well-Known Member
I thought this thread was about an e.r. doctor stabbed to death while on a ride. Very entertaining discussion about guns though.
R.I.P. Dr. Mammone
w_b
Well-Known Member
It’s not about trust at all. Why TF would I care if my kids’ friends’ parents ask if I have guns; I telll them the truth. If they ask if they are unlocked and accessible I also reply in kind. They can leave if they don’t like my answers. If I don’t know them I don’t care about them anyway.
If they stay maybe they get invited to shoot with us next time.
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thegock
Well-Known Member
I just meant that ur suggestion that the "msm" is suppressing the news of the "good guy with a gub."
Good guy with a gub
Unless my math is wrong, about 2.8% of these incidents in the link are cases where a citizen bystander shot the suspect.
FAKE MATH?
Objective: Determine the relative frequency with which guns in the home are used to injure or kill in self-defense, compared with the number of times these weapons are involved in an unintentional injury, suicide attempt, or criminal assault or homicide.
Methods: We reviewed the police, medical examiner, emergency medical service, emergency department, and hospital records of all fatal and nonfatal shootings in three U.S. cities: Memphis, Tennessee; Seattle, Washington; and Galveston, Texas.
Results: During the study interval (12 months in Memphis, 18 months in Seattle, and Galveston) 626 shootings occurred in or around a residence. This total included 54 unintentional shootings, 118 attempted or completed suicides, and 438 assaults/homicides. Thirteen shootings were legally justifiable or an act of self-defense, including three that involved law enforcement officers acting in the line of duty. For every time a gun in the home was used in a self-defense or legally justifiable shooting, there were four unintentional shootings, seven criminal assaults or homicides, and 11 attempted or completed suicides.
Conclusions: Guns kept in homes are more likely to be involved in a fatal or nonfatal accidental shooting, criminal assault, or suicide attempt than to be used to injure or kill in self-defense.
Not sure how many of these were family members, but I am sure an intelligent person like TJ can let us know.
More MSM lies?
The issue with that math is it is gun centric rather than event centric. Probability of B given A, vs B happened probability of A caused it.
Ie you can't have a suicide by gun if there is no gun, but you can have suicide without a gun.
Accidental - accidents happen. This has been discussed. If there are no stairs in a house, you can't fall down them.
That being said, you can't defend yourself with a gun if you don't have one and it is not accessible when needed. This does not mean the kitchen drawer during poker night. Biometric safe or mount.
Ie you can't have a suicide by gun if there is no gun, but you can have suicide without a gun.
Accidental - accidents happen. This has been discussed. If there are no stairs in a house, you can't fall down them.
That being said, you can't defend yourself with a gun if you don't have one and it is not accessible when needed. This does not mean the kitchen drawer during poker night. Biometric safe or mount.
Mahnken
Well-Known Member
The chances of you commiting suicide significantly increase if you own (have access to) a gun.
And reducing injury/death during a home invasion does not decrease with gun ownership
Self-defense gun use is rare and not more effective at preventing injury than other protective actions
Victims use guns in less than 1% of contact crimes, and women never use guns to protect themselves against sexual assault (in more than 300 cases). Victims using a gun were no less likely to be injured after taking protective action than victims using other forms of protective action. Compared to other protective actions, the National Crime Victimization Surveys provide little evidence that self-defense gun use is uniquely beneficial in reducing the likelihood of injury or property loss.
Hemenway D, Solnick SJ. The epidemiology of self-defense gun use: Evidence from the National Crime Victimization Surveys 2007-2011. Preventive Medicine. 2015; 79: 22-27.
I really don't care about this part of the conversation, honestly. Because it's nearly impossible to sway someone's perception of gun ownership. What I'd like to talk about, or see done in this country, is coming up with ways to curb the gun violence. I believe that starts with a lot of inner city work where most of this violence occurs. And has little to do with who owns guns in suburbia. But I also believe there are just way too many myths surrounding gun ownership and safety.
mntal
Well-Known Member
how many of the guns from the study were legally obtained and, which ones used in what events were legally obtained.
To add to the first part of your post, a minor detail that can make a huge difference, is gun type. A handgun is a hell of a lot more dangerous than say a shotgun - easier to handle, easier to self-harm. And in the hypothetical self-defense situation, a lot more dangerous to neighbors in close quarters. But people seek handguns for self defense and do what @Patrick is saying and leave a loaded gun in a drawer. Add a kid, or add alcohol, or even worse, both and that is where the bad stuff happens.
That’s said - and agree here - is the violence in poor and urban areas. Guns are banned in a lot of major cities, yet the shootings are through the roof. Classifying a drive by as a mass shooting versus the suburban mass shooting - is it the same problem? Do they both need the same solutions? I don’t know.
Tim
aka sptimmy43
Do guns have any value as a deterrent? Can the presence of a gun prevent a crime from occurring? Are there any stats on how often a gun is used, but not discharged, in self-defense? My guess would be that those events go largely un-reported to police.
Or have access to a high building, train tracks, or a car and garage.
What I will cede is that in a snap decision to kill oneself, access to a gun may not allow for a cool down time.
Those more intent, it makes no difference. And those that dont have a gun, don't obtain one to attempt/accomplish it.
This is not gun control in this case, it is mental health.
Same in the case of mass shootings.
Probably the same with sexual assault.
Crime for profit with a gun is different.
Socio economic issues do need to be addressed.
Do we think that the gun laws for law abiding owners in NJ make us more aware and less cavalier with them?
I remember visiting an uncle, and guns were in a glass front case with ammo in the drawer.
Anecdotal, of course, but a good friend of mine has told me that if he'd had easy access to a gun at certain points in his life, he wouldn't be here today. I do think that it's fundamentally a different thing to pick up a gun and in one step make a rash decision to end things vs committing to jumping off of a building, bridge, or the car/garage.
I guess what I'm saying is that if the population that's committing suicide via gun annually did not have access, I'd bet there's a good chance that a lot of them would not have sought out another method or carried it through. And that's at least worth taking into consideration in the discussion.
tonyride
Don't piss off the red guy
19-Year-Old Winds Up Shot Dead by Dad After Allegedly Breaking Into Home with Mom and Kids Inside
"The suspect was declared deceased at the scene," the local police department said in a statement. The investigation is ongoing.
www.westernjournal.com
19-Year-Old Winds Up Shot Dead by Dad After Allegedly Breaking Into Home with Mom and Kids Inside
"The suspect was declared deceased at the scene," the local police department said in a statement. The investigation is ongoing.
There could be something to be learned from this story, but posting a link to a Western Journal article from Facebook (example from the article: "Food prices and the overall cost of living have surged dramatically under Joe Biden’s failed presidency, so it’s no surprise that there has been an accompanying spike in crime across the country.") isn't the best way to foster a good faith discussion.
Edit: And just as a slight aside, I wasn't there and have no idea if the homeowner's reaction was appropriate or not, but there's nothing in this article (or any others that I've found quickly googling) that backs up a claim of burglary. Could just as easily have been a 19 year old under the influence thinking that he was at a different house. I knew someone in college who got disoriented and forced himself into someone else's house and I have a friend who had a confused guy banging on his door in the middle of the night thinking it was his house. Just seems a little premature to call this some kind of resounding victory for "Stand your ground" laws.
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