Knees and back health

First hurt my back in college doing squats (maybe? It didn't start hurting until later in the day). A pretty solid year of sciatica pain and useless PT followed. Hurt my back far less seriously - few days of rest type of stuff - lifting, cycling, getting out of bed probably at least 100 times thereafter.

It's really hard to figure out. I just read a study that claimed bad posture and lifting with a rounded back and all of the other bad things we've learned about actually don't contribute any more to injury than using the correct form. I'm done with squatting and DLs. The whole strengthen your core thing with those exercises is bro science BS IMO. I've hurt myself using good form dozens of times. I notice with cycling that I have to be really cautious about tensing up when going hard. That can lead to minor annoyance that can very easily tip into a week long injury just by moving the wrong way. Hard mattresses and lying instead of sitting when possible work for me as well.
 
phillychris498 said:
What mattress did you get? Inquiring fellow mountain bikers with sore backs who sleep on their sides would love to know
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I ended up getting a new mattress a week post op (thankfully with pickup of the old mattress and delivery). We got a saatva memory foam hybrid. It's way firmer than anything I've ever had but I've grown to absolutely love it. I sleep incredible every night and any back crankiness I went to bed with is gone in the AM.
 
jdog said:
Ive been trying to get up to three minutes with a dead hang. My hands hate me for trying.

Then I see this guy:

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My buddy and I used to train for motocross. I would always beat him in the hanging competition. My neighbor is a paid FF and a competitive one at that. He thought it would be easy to beat me at that. I hadn't done tin 10 years or more and was able to do2 minutes before I got bored.
 
Cassinonorth said:
I have a ton of knowledge and opinions on back pain, I will say I have soured on McGill in recent months. I spent 2 months with a McGill Master Clinician to start after 2 months at a run of the mill local PT that was 15 minutes of exercises then 15 minutes of heat and stim. All that and I still ended up getting a L4/L5 microdiscectomy back in February. Orth and both surgeons I consulted all were positive.

His opinions on back surgery are off base. The stigma towards surgery as an option (when needed) is very harmful and people living with sciatica being pushed to "just do the big 3 bro!! or just walk!!" It's idiotic. I got my life back that day. I was laying on the couch 10+ hours a day any day I wasn't working. It was the only position that didn't agrivate my nerve. I returned to the bike trainer 4 weeks post op, the road 10 weeks post op and now mountain biking 5 months out. I feel fantastic day to day. If I didn't get surgery there's a chance I would've lost strength in my leg and the nerve could've been permanently damaged.

I will say protecting my spine day to day is a concern and will be for the rest of my life. I don't sit on bad couches, I alternate standing and sitting at work 1:1 ratio, I don't bend my back to pick things up (golfer lift, split squat or hip hinge), I do core work and stretch every day especially before rides. All that so I can go mountain bike and fingers crossed never have to have another MD.
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I strongly disagree with surgery. Typically they are more unsafe and unsuccessful than a bad back. I will start by saying this. The body heals. My back problems started whenI used to be a Snapple warehouse guy and delivery driver. I was just as competitive then as I am now. Try yanking on a hand truck up and down stairs, off the back of a box truck etc with each case being 45lbs and lifting probably 2000 + cases a day. Then I raced and road motocross for 20+years. Vertical spiral fracture of my femur into the knee joint left me with a crooked posture and muscle atrophy on my left quad.

In 2008 I slipped on wet grass and tore where my sacrum connects to my pelvis resulting in 4 months of extreme sciatica nerve problems. I basically couldn't get out of bed without an hour's notice. I ended up doing 6 months of pt with an Australian spine specialist at Bridgewater sports medicine and was back riding motocross the next spring. Iron Furnace 2018...I had a coach, great fitness and a never say die attitude. First lap I put my foot out and a wet board and slipped. Reinjury of the sacrum had me bed ridden for 2 weeks. Some oral steroids and muscle relaxers along with a daily morning/evening walk got me back to normal. This happened again in 2020 at the WTF race. I ended up with a pain management dr doing a facet joint injection. I was pain free for 3 years until just before the gran rondo nationals and my back flared up again. Guess what fixed it The oral steroids and a new road bike fit by Matt mcgoey from American Bicycles in Damascus, Md. I've been pain free since.

On a side note I followed the McGill big 3 for about 6 months and it really helped. The biggest thing I have found that works though is going for daily walk in the am and pm with some minor change in elevation. Walking almost always puts you core back in the right spot. And yes, I have been at the point where I couldn't walk or couldn't do it well. I'd be willing to bet that oral steroids would have calmed you sciatica down. Inflammation is the hiddenbMotherFer and avoiding exercise is the only thing that will help it calm down.

Now, onto Wilderness 101 tomorrow on the SS.
 
Dave Taylor said:
I strongly disagree with surgery. Typically they are more unsafe and unsuccessful than a bad back. I will start by saying this. The body heals.
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Dave, FFS, this is why you get your balls broken here. I'm glad you didn't need surgery. I truly am. And yes, there are certainly risks to surgery. Any surgery. But to tell others, with zero medical training and zero paitent history, that you disagree with ANYONE getting surgery is completely ignorant. I'd sooner take investment advice from you.

A broken leg will heal on it's own, too. Do you suggest that's the proper approach for that injury as well?
 
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It's hard opting for surgery especially when your hobby is cycling.

Mechanical injuries often need to resolve with mechanical solutions. The body is redundant but you can't grow disk height. I believe any day where you don't relieve compression is another day closer to being in pain as we all lose disk height.
 
Pre, post or sans surgery, you should be doing something every week to strengthen these muscles. These muscles are your body's weight belt and back brace. Regardless of your structural issues, these "core" muscles should be as strong as possible or you will be short changing yourself.

I have had great success with clients post opp and great success with clients who were able to avoid surgery altogther. Sometimes, surgery can't be avoided but many times it can be delayed or eliminated with the right exercise program.

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Cassinonorth said:
I ended up getting a new mattress a week post op (thankfully with pickup of the old mattress and delivery). We got a saatva memory foam hybrid. It's way firmer than anything I've ever had but I've grown to absolutely love it. I sleep incredible every night and any back crankiness I went to bed with is gone in the AM.
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A good mattress makes all the difference. I have a Reverie that I use to sleep in the zero gravity position, among others, and wake up every morning without a sore back. It has greatly helped keep my back out of trouble and helped it heal through periodic episodes. They’re an investment, but it’s a 20 year bed (high standards/quality) and good sleep is necessary to heal and recover. In a side note, sleeping in the zero gravity position also helps if you have sleep apnea and/or gastritis (omg…I’m only 45…what’s happens next in the 50,s 😂?)
 
Carson said:
Dave, FFS, this is why you get your balls broken here. I'm glad you didn't need surgery. I truly am. And yes, there are certainly risks to surgery. Any surgery. But to tell others, with zero medical training and zero paitent history, that you disagree with ANYONE getting surgery is completely ignorant. I'd sooner take investment advice from you.

A broken leg will heal on it's own, too. Do you suggest that's the proper approach for that injury as well?
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Nope. Sure, surgery is necessary for a very small percentage of people. I “swore” I needed back surgery several times. With so many botched back surgeries I would try 3000 other ways before i remotely consider back surgery. If you’re bed for 6 months the first thing to do is figure out how to reduce the inflammation. I am a big fan of dr mcgill. His one fox of the champion weightlifter with shattered l5/l5 and a split sacrum is enough to become a believer. All healed without surgery and he went on to break his own deadlift world record.
 
Ironjunk said:
It's hard opting for surgery especially when your hobby is cycling.

Mechanical injuries often need to resolve with mechanical solutions. The body is redundant but you can't grow disk height. I believe any day where you don't relieve compression is another day closer to being in pain as we all lose disk height.
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Degenerative disk disorder is present in every human.
 
I can’t pin point when I starting having lower back problems but Daily exercise and like 3/4 days per week of strength training has done a lot for my body since the start of this year. It could be as little as 10 minutes and include the muscles @a.s. mentioned. It’s also helped my knee that I ran sprained running into a tree snowboarding like 7 years ago.
 
THATmanMANNY said:
I can’t pin point when I starting having lower back problems but Daily exercise and like 3/4 days per week of strength training has done a lot for my body since the start of this year. It could be as little as 10 minutes and include the muscles @a.s. mentioned. It’s also helped my knee that I ran sprained running into a tree snowboarding like 7 years ago.
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I am not a “workout” type person, but this spot on. So much of workout culture is to go hard/heavy/ if you aint sore it didnt work. With the core work i do, minimal investment in time shows big results. I will even say 5 min a day…
 
Surgery scares the shit out me, I’ll do everything i can to avoid or prolong it. I’ve had more people tell me they regret having back surgery than not. That’s going back several decades, but I’m sure (hope) procedures are better with more knowledge now.

The doctor offered injections but after learning more I decided to hold off. Even still, the PT and activity will only hold them off so long. Five years, ten if I’m lucky. I’m only 53 but have already lost 2” in height, which shocked me.
 
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